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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 6:45 pm 
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With the possibility of a variant-supporting on the webdiplomacy system growing more and more likely as time passes, an important question begs to be asked.

How will the current system of ghostratings (I am assuming everyone here knows what I am talking about) be affected by the introduction of variants? The ratings have become the most widely recognized way of comparing skill, and think everyone who plays on webdip has either heard of them, or will in the future.

Clearly they are important, and thier implementation into variants is also important to the site.

Should the results from variant games be clumped in with regular games? I assume that the elo-type system can just as easily be used for five, six, etc. players as seven. This would mean little to no confusion insofar as comparing skill is concerned.

Or should there be a seperate rating system for each variant? After all, each one is a different game, a different challenge, and untested variants may be far less balanced than regular diplomacy. This would save the 'pure' ratings from being diluted.

Or should the ghostrating not bother with variants at all?

Presumably TheGhostMaker has some ideas on this subject, being the creator of the ratings, and others as may well.

I'd be interested in seeing what everyone thinks about this.


-Friendly Sword


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 8:27 pm 
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I'm not going to do anything about it just yet, but I lean towards the solution that is reducing the amount of change in ratings for variants, but keeping it as a single rating.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:32 pm 
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Ghost, with the reduced amount of change for variants, would that include the currently supported variants (no press and public press?) I'm not sure I would include the anonymous feature as a variant though.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2009 4:47 pm 
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It would include them

anon features aren't a variant, no.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:02 am 
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I posted this originally in a pm to kestas but it would seem like this is a better forum for this discussion... With minor edits here is the discussion...

> 3) A link to TGM's league and rating site from the main page, and have ones GhostRating more prominently shown on the profile
> page.  This will make it more visible and discourage the multiaccounters and allow the rest of us to be able to identify them easier.  I
> think that a good amount of users don't even know about their Ghost Rating. Or even that the system exists.
>
> 4) Some way to link GhostRatings between Olidip and Webdip.  It's a shame that as most may go to olidip to play, their ratings are
> not linked to their main webdip accounts.  I know this is a tough one, as somebodies rating on a variant may not really be a valid
> contributor to their GhostRating on the classic version of the game but ah well, I thought that I would mention this to see if you or
> TGM had any thoughts on this.

Regarding the ghostratings / TGM requests, that's something I need more from TGM on. I've tried to get him to better integrate the league and ghostratings into the site, and at first he wanted to do this as well, but recently he has backed off as the algorithm is complex and wouldn't translate well into PHP.
Without that any sort of league or ghostratings integration can't really be done, though I'll bring it up with him again and see if I can get him to reveal how it works. I'd definitely like to get league/tournament functionality built-in, because it's an effective way of managing a lot of the unpleasant aspects of random games.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:09 am 
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Yup thanks for posting that idea here, it would be good to get an official specification for how ghost ratings can be calculated and tournament get automated

I'm also going to work towards opening up the server so it can be scripted by external systems, e.g. allowing games to be created and users assigned via external APIs, which could possible let an automated tournament system be implemented on a different site using its own code while still using an existing server (even working across alternate servers e.g. to access different variants)


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 8:34 am 
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An API would definitely be a great leap forward. Besides opening up the game to different potential front ends ( for lightweight smart phones), it may also make integrating games with bots a possibility. Presuming the API would cover the entering of orders as well.
But let's make that a topic for another thread.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:19 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:46 pm
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Hello,

The formulae are, I think, available somewhere, and Tantris has written a perl script which calculates it. About a year ago I made the decision not to ask or look at making the system more official.

I backed off more because I was clearly starting to bug kestas with it than anything. I'm okay with the status quo regarding Ghost-Ratings.


Tournament integration is something that both kestas and I think would both like to see more of. There is a relevant post in the ideas/requests forum.

I am away at the moment, and then off to uni 3 days after getting back, but I'll try to be helpful about how leagues etc. all work.


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